As the mother of teenagers, I have had many uncertain moments over the past eighteen years—the pandemic, divisive politics, and the erosion of women’s rights in the U.S. were not things I anticipated when I became a mother. How do we keep hope alive for a new generation of women?
Uncertain Girls in Uncertain Times (Red Hen Press), edited by Joyce Chen and Donna Wolf, provides a much-needed balm for the pain and uncertainty. The project started as a graduation gift from Donna Wolf to her daughter Evie in 2019:
"Donna had suggested gifting her a collection of recipes to launch her into adulthood, something her own mother had done for her, and Evie countered, 'How about a collection of poems to guide me through the uncertainties of life instead?'"
The final product provides such a thoughtful capsule of the years since, in essays written by women of different ages, backgrounds, ethnicities, religions and industries. Each provides a bit of light and encouragement, sharing their own experiences and hinge moments where one must choose a new path, learn a skill, cross continents for work, or overcome fear.
The chapters each center a different feeling and action—wonder, worry, waiting, wanting, and the will to take chances. Here, you'll find brief essays paired with a poem.
Elizabeth Bishop, Sandra Cisneros, Jayne Cortez, Nikki Giovanni, Joy Harjo, Ada Limon, Aimee Nezhukumatathil, Naomi Shihab Nye, Nicole Sealey, Danez Smith, Mary Ruefle, and C.D. Wright are some of the poets you'll find in this collection.
Reading Uncertain Girls in Uncertain Times made me realize how impactful and important a role poetry can play in the lives of those who summon it. For years, I carried the Wendell Berry poem, "The Peace of Wild Things" in my wallet, a reminder during stressful years that nature did not need me to succeed at anything. Maybe you have a poem like that, too?
We're honored to have Donna Wolf and Joyce Chen join us here to share their personal poetic inspirations.
Donna Wolf and Joyce Chen, welcome to The Poetry Shop 5! Please tell us about your new book.
Donna Wolf: Uncertain Girls in Uncertain Times (Red Hen Press) began with a request from my daughter, Evie, in the months leading up to her college graduation. I’d offered to give her a collection of recipes to launch her into adulthood, something my mother had done for me. Evie, knowing her poetry-loving mother, had a different idea: “How about a collection of poems to guide me through the uncertainties of life instead?” She asked, and of course I wanted to deliver. So, I began asking friends for poems that had resonated with them at difficult or uncertain points in their lives. Of course the poems always came with conversation: pieces of advice, hard-won wisdom, and a real interest in having things go well for the next generation of women.
While this was going on, Evie and I continued to talk about her own leap into adulthood, and the hopes and worries she had about what came next. Our conversations happened in 10- or 15-minute spurts, by text, by phone, or over FaceTime, whenever she had a few minutes. Those exchanges continued throughout the year and eventually became the thread that runs through Uncertain Girls.
As I had more of these conversations with women, and Evie and I continued to talk, I began to think this could be a great book not just for Evie, but for all young women launching into adulthood. My co-editor, Joyce Chen, joined the project in 2020, and together we set to work, inviting 40 women, femmes, and nonbinary contributors to reflect on the moments that had challenged and shaped them, the wisdom they had gained along the way, and a poem that had helped them make sense of it all.
Uncertain Girls is about poetry, connection, and the wisdom we pass from one generation to the next. We want young women to feel that there is a whole world of people behind them, and that there are so many ways forward and so many different ways to build a meaningful life.
Joyce Chen: As Donna mentioned, I joined the Uncertain Girls project back in the fall of 2020, and was immediately drawn to its ethos of mutual exchange — that is very much what I’m all about, the idea of community being hand-built, one relationship at a time. I saw so much potential for the project, and it sounded like something I wished I had when I was first graduating college and trying to figure out what an exciting, meaningful life could look like. As someone who’s been fortunate enough to have many great mentors throughout my life — many of them women — I understood the value and the importance of Donna’s idea, and wanted to help bring it into fruition.
Editing Uncertain Girls and working so closely with each of our 40 contributors truly kept me buoyant over these past many years. It’s given me something positive to work toward, especially as the world has been in such a liminal place of uncertainty, what with the pandemic, the worsening climate crisis, the advent of AI, and more. Reading each of our contributors’ thoughtful reflections felt like a true gift every time, a reminder of the quiet power of poetry to embolden, teach, and sustain us.
Who was your "gateway poet," the first poet whose book or poem sparked your interest in poetry?
Donna Wolf: Adrienne Rich. Her poem “In Those Years.” I love the lines: “But the great dark birds of history screamed and plunged into our personal weather.”
Gloria Steinem once said that if you pour water on a poem, it becomes a novel. That’s what I felt when I first read Adrienne Rich’s “In Those Years.” In a few lines, it holds a whole world of clarity and emotion, particularly about what happens when we lose our sense of “we” and become overly focused on “I.”
I came across this poem working on a paper for my master in Organizational Development. I remember reading “In Those Years” over and over. I was struck by how much Rich brought to light in so few words and the idea that our personal lives never really exist apart from the larger world around us, a very important concept in organizational development. It was one of the poems that showed me the super power of poetry.
Joyce Chen: Wildly, I think I can trace my interest in poetry back to high school, and reading “The Love Song of J. Alfred Prufrock” by T.S. Eliot. Our English teacher had the class memorize different lines of the poem and it was an incredibly Dead Poets Society moment for me.
What I remember most about reading this poem alongside my high school English class was how moved I felt by its message — this idea of standing in your own way — something I could relate to even though I don’t share a lot of the same identities as T.S. Eliot! There is something so beautiful about recognizing how timeless poetry is, and how it connects people across identities, geography, generation, and life experience. Eliot’s poem made me feel like I could be part of a larger conversation that would continue on long after I’m gone, too. What also struck me was how poetry can be a way to help us, as readers, find a language for our experiences, and to feel a little less alone in our worries and anxieties.
Which poetry book are you currently reading?
Donna Wolf: So many! I’m on the board of Copper Canyon Press, so I’m lucky enough to get early copies of all their books. Right now, I’m reading Paisley Rekdal’s Heritance.
My dad is gone and my mom is aging, so my sisters and I are talking more these days about inheritance and legacy. Those conversations have me thinking about the other side of inheritance too: what I want to pass down to my own kids.
I think that’s why Heritance is resonating so much with me right now. Paisley is such a clear and intelligent poet, and the book gives voice to so much of what is complicated about inheritance: what we receive, what we carry, and what we choose to pass on.
Joyce Chen: I’m currently re-reading Let the Moon Wobble (Alice James Books) by Ally Ang. It’s a slim collection but a really expansive one, addressing topics like capitalism, identity, sexuality, and pleasure, all through the lens of Ally’s singular, somatic language.
Ally Ang is a dear poet friend out here in Seattle, and one of the biggest joys I’ve found in being a part of a literary community is getting to really sit and revel in friends’ many years-long art and writing. Ally is someone whose humor, sharp insight, and curiosity is so palpable off the page, and getting the chance to dig into their collection on the page feels like such a gift. Their debut collection is the kind of earnest, clear-eyed poetry that makes you sit up straighter, nod your head in agreement, and want to tell someone about the fantastic poem you just read.
Is there a book on the craft of writing that you recommend to poets?
Joyce Chen: Though it’s not necessarily a straight craft book, Carl Phillips’ My Trade is Mystery (Yale University Press), is a beautiful, evergreen book for any creative.
What I really appreciate about Phillips’ book is that it’s speaking as much about what happens off the page as about what happens on it, and how to pursue this elusive, necessary thing called art and craft. It’s about figuring out what we are passionate about and how to sustain a lifelong relationship with that passion. I first read this book while on a writing residency in Vermont, and it has been a touchstone for me to return to time and again when I need a little dose of inspiration to keep on keeping on!
Who is a new voice in poetry that we need to check out–someone with a debut book or recent release?
Donna Wolf: The Cardinals: Poems (Red Hen Press) by Amy Speace
I’ve had Amy’s book on pre-order for a while. I’ve been following her as a singer-songwriter for a long time, so I’ve been super curious to read her poetry. I just got the book yesterday and am trying to savor each poem, although I’ll admit that’s been super hard and I’ve already read half the poems. Her poetry is every bit as good as her songwriting.
Joyce Chen: HUM (Backwaters Press) by Sanam Sheriff
I first met Sanam when they were a participant in one of my literary nonprofit’s digital residencies a few years back, and then again when they helped to curate a mini folio through our Community Anthologies program last year. Their poetry is soulful, searching, beautiful and tender. This is their debut collection, framed through the eyes of a queer, trans, Muslim speaker who is seeking solace in themselves, their identity, their countries (of origins and of choice), and their body. I cannot wait for more readers to discover their work!
Finally, what’s a poetry book that others may not know about but deserves a shout out?
Donna Wolf: Deema Shehabi’s Thirteen Departures from the Moon (Press 53)
One of the big joys of Uncertain Girls was discovering new poetry. One of our contributors chose “A Summer’s Tale with Firebirds,” a poem by Deema Shehabi, a Palestinian poet whose work I had not read before. It is beautiful, lyrical, and poignant. Check it out!
Joyce Chen: Saba Keramati’s Self-Mythology (University of Arkansas Press)
Saba Keramati’s Self-Mythology is a marvel, and in it, she explores concepts of home that I feel deep kinship with — trying to find a place within a world that often can’t contain you, or make sense of your many identities. Here, Saba is specifically digging into questions of multiraciality, but just as loud and clear in her poems is the question of belonging — how to find it, how to cultivate it — that feels resonant to any Uncertain Girl out there.
About the Editors
Donna Wolf is the past board chair of Copper Canyon Press and an avid student and lover of poetry. She runs LouLoup Consulting and has worked extensively in the Seattle nonprofit community, focusing on education, culture, and civic engagement. She is passionate about connecting people to poetry and bringing poetry into public spaces. She is a graduate of the University of Oregon, has a teaching certificate in secondary education, and holds a master’s in Organizational Development from Seattle University. She is the mother of three young adults, all of whom are jumping, leaping, and launching into adulthood.
Joyce Chen is a writer, editor, and community builder. She’s one of the co-founders and the executive director of the Seventh Wave, a BIPOC- and queer-led literary arts nonprofit that champions art in the space of social issues. As a writer, she toes the line between journalism (her professional background) and creative nonfiction, though poetry has always had her heart. She’s currently working on a memoir-in-essays about trees, time, and Taiwan, where her family is from. And as an editor, she works with writers of all levels through coaching and editing services. Nothing brings her greater joy than helping others find their voice on the page and tell their essential stories.
Books referenced in this article.
Uncertain Girls in Uncertain Times (Red Hen Press) edited by Joyce Chen & Donna Wolf
Books by Adrienne Rich
Books by T.S. Eliot
Heritance (Copper Canyon Press) by Paisley Rekdal
Let the Moon Wobble (Alice James Books) by Ally Ang
My Trade is Mystery (Yale University Press) by Carl Phillips
The Cardinals: Poems (Red Hen Press) by Amy Speace
HUM (Backwaters Press) by Sanam Sheriff
Thirteen Departures from the Moon (Press 53) by Deema Shehabi
Self-Mythology (University of Arkansas Press) by Saba Keramati